0:06 - Welcome to Freedomain Radio
10:56 - Drug Use and Society
27:44 - Addicts and Their Choices
28:45 - Caffeine and Dependency
35:53 - Childhood Reflections
51:05 - Relationships and Personal Growth
57:12 - Childhood Shadows
1:00:26 - Drug-Free Relationships
1:02:23 - The Impact of Parenting
1:06:05 - Forgiveness and Restitution
1:11:22 - Confronting Our Parents
1:18:27 - Breaking the Cycle
1:26:19 - Parenting Standards
1:38:45 - The Weight of Expectations
1:44:55 - Stories vs. Lies
In this episode, I delve deep into a wide array of topics, igniting thoughtful dialogue and introspection among listeners. We open with a brief announcement about an upcoming donor-only discussion, inviting those interested to join in at Freedomain.locals.com. The atmosphere is subsequently charged as we transition into the heart of the evening's discourse.
Central to our conversation are the pervasive issues surrounding drug use and its cultural ramifications. I share my thoughts on the sympathetic but problematic narratives surrounding substance use, particularly what happens when individuals romanticize or trivialize the struggles associated with addiction. While I acknowledge the trauma that can lead people to seek self-medication, such as through drugs, I emphasize a concern for promoting a culture where drug use is viewed as acceptable or aspirational. The ethical implications of such attitudes are hard to ignore, and I challenge listeners to reconsider the portrayal of drug use in popular media and its actual impact on society.
Engaging listeners, I juxtapose the experiences of those who may find temporary relief in drug use with a critique of a culture that celebrates addiction as an identity. I argue for the importance of discernment, suggesting that while some may find medicinal benefits in certain substances, conflating recreational use with health benefits poses significant problems.
Our discussion evolves as a caller offers a personal narrative, prompting an examination of various perspectives on drug use and performance-enhancing substances. I emphasize the distinction between medical use and recreational drug use, encouraging a critical look at motivations behind both. As we engage in a spirited exploration of philosophy, ethics, and personal responsibility, I reaffirm that just because something is fashionable or endorsed by cultural icons doesn't inherently validate its worth or safety.
We pivot to a more profound discussion about personal histories, trauma, and parental relationships. I explore the complexities of forgiveness within dysfunctional family dynamics, differentiating between acknowledging past harm and holding on to unproductive grudges. As we share insights, I urge my listeners to take personal responsibility for their choices and narratives, advocating for an honest appraisal of family legacies. I challenge the notion of unconditional love when faced with continued abusive behavior, underscoring that loving someone shouldn't obscure the need for healthy boundaries.
Throughout the episode, I aim to empower my listeners to confront difficult truths and make constructive choices that benefit their future relationships. By articulating thoughts on self-improvement and parenting, I inspire families to strive for healthier dynamics, free from the shadows of past trauma. As the conversation wraps up, I remind everyone about the importance of active participation in their own lives and relationships, encouraging a pursuit of self-awareness and growth.
Finally, the episode ends on an open note, with invitations for continued conversation and engagement in future discussions, reiterating the communal aspect of our journey towards understanding ourselves and each other better.
[0:00] Hi, everybody. Stefan Molyneux from Freedomain Radio. Good evening. Welcome to your show.
[0:07] And let's see.
[0:12] Yes. Is it a Twitter space? Yes. Yes. Okay. It is a Twitter space. Hi, everybody. Stefan Molyneux from Freedomain. Hope you're doing well. Hope you're having a lovely day. Let's get straight to it. It's your show.
[0:29] Sunday, Sunday, chatty Sunday, we're going to be doing a donor-only show, uh, 11 a.m. And if you want to join into that, you can, of course, go to freedomain.locals.com, freedomain.locals.com, sign up for that, and we'll be doing it that way tonight. All right, so let's get to here and see. You can just ask to chat, bring yourself into the conversation. Uh thrilled to chat of course thrilled to have that kind of conversation with you you and, uh go check out uh colin james just whenever you can uh i'm on alan parsons kick at the moment and a colin james uh kick and that is some lovely juicy delightful stuff so i hope you will check that out uh go and listen to him and uh the birmingham singer amanda marshall doing keep on loving me live? Smoking. Smoking. So, I've been talking to some drug users today. It's funny because I just kind of forget these big controversies because like in my life, they're just not around. Obviously, I don't really have any drug users in my life. And.
[1:46] Yeah, it's been a while. It's been a while since I've been around the rampant justifications of the drug addict. And listen, again, I talked about this today. I'll just keep it briefly here. I have great sympathy for the kind of childhood upset and trauma that has people turn to drugs, self-medicate. I have great sympathy for that. And nothing but love for the people who are struggling to overcome childhood stuff and all of that. Beautiful. You're magnificent. Heroic. But the people who try to make it cool or like it's natural and Terrence McKenna and Johns Hopkins studies and PTSD trauma fixing and so on. And I have a great time and it's great and it's fun and it's good. The people who praise it and promote it, that is not good. That is not a good situation. If you've got some upset, some sadness, probably from childhood, massive sympathies, but...
[2:46] If you're making it cool and selling it to others, this way of avoiding things, that's not cool. That's not cool at all. But again, if you disagree with me, I'm certainly happy to be set straight. And this idea that, well, Stef, you've never done drugs, so you can't comment on them. It's like, well, you know, I haven't beat my balls with a baseball hammer either. But that doesn't mean that I can't have any opinions about it or can't have any thoughts about whether it's good or bad. I haven't injected bleach into my veins either. I haven't drunk antifreeze or brain rotten moonshine. I haven't done any of that. Does that mean that I can't have any perspectives or opinions about these things? Well, of course I can. Of course I can.
[3:35] So i hope that uh gives you at least some answers as to where uh where i'm coming from so this idea that i can't comment on things unless i've experienced them directly that's why it's called philosophy and you know we can we can say things if you're a physicist you can say things about mars without actually having visited mars because it's universal principles right so you can say things about things without having done them. I've never murdered anyone, but I have an opinion about it. I really do. So again, if you have any questions, comments, you disagree, you want to set me straight, I'm obviously thrilled to hear from you. You can just raise your hand and come into the conversation and set me straight. I'd be thrilled to have you do that. And if there's something I don't understand, I'm obviously happy to be schooled on it and so on. But.
[4:29] You know, and if some people benefit from some sort of drug with regards to PTSD or something like that, hey, great. I mean, maybe it could be used in a medicinal sense, but not recreationally, right? You know, not right. You know, like laughing gas should be used maybe if you're going to get your wisdom teeth out, but not recreationally, right? So saying conflating when you're doing something for medical reasons, as opposed to something recreationally, conflating those two things is kind of a sad cope. And I guess this is the thing too, is that the people who do drugs and the people who don't do drugs, they just seem to kind of live in really different worlds.
[5:10] And I think crossovers are good. I think crossovers are good. So for people who take drugs recreationally, which is really what I'm talking about, because people are like, oh, so you've never taken an aspirin. It's like, And aspirin is not an escape from self or reality. It doesn't alter my perceptions. It doesn't mess with my brain chemistry. It's just a minor painkiller, right? So I think it's good to have this kind of crossover where people who don't take drugs get to interact with people who do take drugs and you get to have a robust back and forth, right? That seems to me like a good plan. I mean, don't we want to widen our conversations to include people we wouldn't normally talk with? I don't normally talk with people who do this kind of stuff, but on the plus side, they don't normally talk with me either. And it seems to be a good, a good crossover. So I hope that people will listen to that. And here's the other thing too.
[6:07] You know, if you're a drug user and I don't mean that you tried pot once when you were 20, who cares? Like it doesn't matter, right? But what I'm talking about is if you justify it as a good thing. And by the by, just my sort of general opinion is anything Hollywood promotes, I just dislike automatically, just anything that Hollywood promotes. And you sort of think of the Seth Rogen stoner comedies or the, you know, gotta, gotta, gotta get a party, gotta drink, gotta, all of this sort of stuff. I mean, it's all just rampant degeneracy. And so if you're on the side of, of Hollywood, in on anything, you're, you're, you're dancing with the devil and, uh, uh, bending over to pick up soap in the demonic shower of general social corruption. That's just my particular approach with those kinds of things. It's not an absolute standard, but it's a pretty good first pass. So yeah, whatever that stuff is promoted. And the other thing too, like you might be wrong. You might be wrong. You might be wrong. And I would have a certain amount of respect for.
[7:06] People who, if I'm bringing up sort of criticisms of drug use, say, you know, I thought about that, maybe it isn't a good idea, but here's the thing, blah, blah, blah. But it's all like, no, it's absolutely great. It's absolutely perfect. There's no problem with it. No issues. You're just a close-minded, narrow-brained bigot. And, you know, it's like, so you just have insults, right? And the insults fly pretty fast and furious. Now, I'm not claiming victimhood here. If I refer to people as druggies and say it's bad, I understand that it is not something where I can say, oh, oh, but I'm such a victim. I, I, delicate little flower that I am, never said anything negative, wrong, or bad, never had anything critical. They just, they just swarmed me for no reason. I get that. It's kind of provocative. But here's the thing, right? I mean, if drugs make you so mature, then you should be able to handle some criticism. Should be. I mean, somebody was saying, you know, Stef, you know, the drugs, they really just help me feel at one with everything and they make their gentleness and connection. But yours is a really shit take. It's like, yes, I feel that connection, bro. I really do. I really do. It's like all the people who get mad at me when I tell them that forgiveness should be earned. It's like, let's say I'm wrong. Shouldn't you just forgive me rather than get mad at me? I don't know. If you want to have credibility in this life as a whole.
[8:28] Then it is pretty important to actually live the values that you are proposing to others, right? If I'm going to promote peaceful parenting, it's kind of important that I be a peaceful parent, wouldn't you say? If I am going to promote forgiving people who apologize and make restitution, then when somebody does me wrong, apologizes and makes restitution, then I should forgive them. And I've done those conversations. I've had conversations with people who were harsh, ugly, and vicious trolls for a long time, and they finally saw the light and realized that I was a good guy trying to do good things and often achieving good things.
[9:13] And I have conversations, they're forgiven, they're part of the conversation. So if people, and of course, I have apologized to people and made restitution. I criticized someone unjustly on one of the live streams a couple of months ago. I gave him a free two-hour call-in, which is, you know, not cheap for some people, and promised to never do that again. So I made my apologies, made my restitution. So you should live by the values that you espouse. And if drugs make you so wise, then you should be able to handle some criticism, even if it's harsh, right? See, the funny thing is, you know, Stef, philosophy is useless. Philosophy is a useless, abstract, nonsense, what the hell has it ever achieved discipline, right? Philosophy is useless. And they come at me quite harsh. I mean, well, they come at me quite strong. I suppose you could say it's harsh. They come at me strong.
[10:11] Right. I mean, tell me more, if it's any consolation. I've had exactly the same criticisms about philosophy for many years. The reason I got into philosophy was because nobody was doing what needed to be done. Nobody was doing what needed to be done. In particular, talking about the ethics and virtue of childhood parenting and child raising. So, yeah, but if people come, or if people come in me and say, well, Stef, what good has your show ever done? Right? And I say, well, according to my recent calculations, I have prevented about a billion and a half, a billion and a half violent acts against children.
[10:56] It's not that hard because children are aggressed against by parents in some studies 17 times a week. So you just have to convince, you know, I've had a billion views and downloads, even if I just say, okay, I've just convinced a million parents over the last 20 years, I've convinced a million parents scattered over that time to not hit their children. That's a billion and a half children not being hit. Now, I could count not being yelled at, verbally abused, and so on, but let's just say not being hit. So that's practical, measurable effects that are positive in the world. But if somebody says to me, show me some good your philosophy show has ever done, I'm like, that's a perfectly reasonable question. And I should show some actual, this is one of the reasons I got out of politics is it's really tough for libertarians to show the good that they have achieved. But as you talk about peaceful parenting, you can actually get the non-aggression principle to be enacted by people as a whole. All right, let's get to your questions, comments, criticisms, challenges. Will, lordy lordy, Will, you are online, on the air, scouring through my neurons like a vole. If you want to unmute, I'm happy to hear what is on your mind.
[12:13] Oh, what's on my mind? besides the conversation earlier I would say should children be considered property of the parents until they move out?
[12:30] Well, they're not the same as property, because you can destroy your own property, but you can't destroy your own children. So, I would say that they are the responsibility of the parents, but they're not the property of the parents. Because you can't, and this is an old argument with regards to slavery, which is you can't have self-ownership and also own other human beings. So, human beings have self-ownership, and owning ourselves means owning our own minds, our own bodies, and also owning the effects of our actions. So, if Bob goes and punches someone, he owns that wound, he has created that wound, he is responsible for that wound, that black eye, or whatever it is. So, we own ourselves and we own the effects of our actions. However, you can't both own yourself and also own another human being. But children, of course, are not independent of their parents because they need their parents' resources in order to survive.
[13:30] So, they are not property, but they are the responsibility of parents, if that makes sense. Because property also can't become un-property, whereas, of course, the whole point of parenting is your children grow up and they become independent of needing you, they become self-sufficient, and that's not the case with property that is like, my pair of glasses is never going to become independent of me and go and look and and see and lust and enjoy sunsets on their own so that static property is just a thing whereas children grow into self-ownership so they can't be considered the property of their parents if that makes sense.
[14:04] Yes um also i kind of just wanted to give you a little bit of pushback on some of the drug um usage uh type stuff like from some of the conversations earlier like let's suppose like there's plenty of different types of drugs out there some of them you could in theory use to like treat whole hosts of different conditions whether that be tremors whether that be fatigue the focus as a nootropic like I'm not saying like sorry hang
[14:42] On hang on you conflated a couple of things there which I think are important to break out. So let's say there's a drug that treats tremors. Is that right?
[14:53] Yeah, like there's people that use like, I think like amphetamines, like if you use like micro doses of them, it can actually upregulate dopamine receptor density.
[15:03] Sorry, is that related? I'm not a doctor. Is that related to tremors?
[15:07] Yes, like tremors and things of that nature that's actually caused by losing too many dopamine receptors from what I heard.
[15:15] I mean, are you sure of that? because I don't want to put out misinformation. I can't vet this in real time.
[15:24] Like, let's suppose, like, if someone loses 70% of their dopamine receptors, they start to develop Parkinson's.
[15:34] Okay. So then there's a drug that could treat the Parkinson's by doing something with the dopamine receptors. Is that right?
[15:43] Well, if you use, like, micro doses of amphetamines, you can upregulate the dopamine receptor density a little bit. Now, like, sure, I'm not going to say, like, that's the only thing, like, you should do, but I'm not going to tell people that they shouldn't, like, try to experiment with, like, different, like, rec drugs or whatnot.
[16:02] Sorry, hang on, hang on, hang on. So we're going from it's a known medical treatment to just, what, guinea pig yourself by cramming drugs into your system?
[16:10] Yeah, so there's plenty of people who do that for themselves. It's like they don't trust doctors. Or you have, like, bodybuilders who'll use, like, anabolic steroids. They'll have, like, their own sex.
[16:22] Sorry, they'll have their own what?
[16:24] Steroid cycles and stacks.
[16:26] Okay, stacks, okay.
[16:27] Yeah. So it's like, yes, you do have just random meatheads who read forums about, all right, what effect does this drug have? And they don't necessarily have a PhD in some place like, let's say Johns Hopkins or any place like that. They just get it from like, I guess like bro science forums, like they might read certain papers and stuff.
[16:52] So they're experimenting on themselves.
[16:54] Yeah, they'll like say, all right, yeah, I'll use like two grams of tests. I'll use 200 milligrams of Trenbolone, maybe some T3, maybe, what else do you like?
[17:07] For the sake of building, hang on, you mean, but that's not for the sake of, hang on, but that's not for the sake of treating any medical condition. That's because they want bigger muscles.
[17:15] Well, yeah, they want bigger muscles. They want certain effects, yeah. So, I mean, that's like, you could use that same logic for treating it.
[17:22] No, no, hang on, bro, bro, you got to stop charging all over the place here. Let me deal with a topic that you bring up. Because you've conflated a whole bunch of things. One is legitimate treatments for medical issues. The other is wanting to feel good. The other is people mixing steroids and other stuff not to treat any medical issues, but because they want bigger muscles. These things are all, they're not all the same. You understand that, right?
[17:51] Even if it's not the same, there's still plenty of overlap. Like, you can still use that same mindset.
[17:56] I don't know what that means. I have no idea what that means.
[18:00] I mean, you could, just as like a meathead chemist, you might have a certain cycle for bulking. Or a juicer might have a different cycle for cutting. They might have a different cycle for treating injuries as well.
[18:17] And?
[18:17] So, and considering that, they could also... Try to like use other rec drugs for other conditions like like that is no no bro
[18:27] Bro it's not a condition to have normal human muscles that's not a health issue that's not a problem.
[18:34] Yeah yeah but like still it's like that people have a certain goal like let's suppose you wanted to be 300 maybe not you yourself but someone else wanted to be 300 pounds stage weight sure like Obviously, that's going to be like a different goal from, do I want to recover from this injury? That might be different from, do I want to treat this other thing in my life? It's like they can have the same mindset, but just as like a bodybuilder might have like a different cycle for, let's say, like a nootropic cycle might use more smart drugs. It might use more rec drugs.
[19:12] Okay, this all just, hang on, you're just going off on stuff that doesn't mean much to anyone outside of that community. So let me ask you this. Are bodybuilders allowed to use steroids in competitions?
[19:23] Depends. In the competition, IFBB, NPC, yes. I don't do steroids, never been on any artificial anabolics. All right. I signed up for PNBA, INBA, not PNBA, but INBA.
[19:38] Do you think that anyone knows what you're talking about? I'm just curious. You're talking to a general audience. Do you have empathy for the general audience that if you just put out a Bunch of acronyms. Anybody know what you're talking about?
[19:49] For NPC or IFBB, International Federation of Bodybuilding, that's not drug tested. People use steroids there all the time.
[20:04] Okay.
[20:06] Those are like the two biggest competitions. So NPC, IFBB, whereas you do have some bodybuilding competitions that are drug tested. But they're generally much smaller. They don't get as many views.
[20:21] And is the purpose of these competitions to win prizes and make money? Is that right?
[20:28] Partially, yes.
[20:29] And what percentage of bodybuilders do you think are making good money on these bodybuilding circuits?
[20:38] So are we talking about professional bodybuilding?
[20:42] Okay, what percentage of people who take steroids are doing it to win $100,000 in some bodybuilding competition or $10,000, whatever it's going to be, $50,000, whatever it's going to be, right? What percentage of the people who take steroids are doing it for that purpose?
[21:00] 1% or less.
[21:02] Okay. So most people are taking steroids to get big muscles for no particular purpose, other than maybe vanity or measuring their muscles or whatever, right? Looking good.
[21:16] Libido as well. Functioning like that. Depression. It helps with plenty of different things.
[21:21] Well, no, but we're talking about body. As well as it prevents injury. Okay, you've got to focus, man. You're not selling these drugs very well because you're not focusing. I'm not talking about people who might take some sort of steroid for some other reason, right? So what I'm talking about is you talked about weightlifters. So the vast majority, the overwhelming majority of weightlifters are taking steroids, endangering their physical and mental health for nothing. Like in terms of no income, no career, no money.
[21:51] I mean, some of them might compete,
[21:53] But I wouldn't say that necessarily. Bro, you just said less than 1%. Hang on. I don't know what the hell's going on with your brain, man. You just told me it's less than 1%.
[22:06] All right, let's say, does steroids versus competes, like has signed up for a show versus is a professional bodybuilder? Those are three different categories. I'd say that we could have.
[22:20] I'm just going off what you tell me, bro. I don't know all these categories. I'm not into that world. I'm simply going by what you tell me. So the vast majority of people who are taking these, I mean, steroids have dangers, right? There's roid rage. There can be heart issues. There are dangers to steroids, right?
[22:37] It's safe to say, yeah, there's liver toxicity, stuff like that. Cancer gross. Yeah.
[22:44] Right. So, there's a lot of people, and what they do is they take these dangerous substances, or substances which can be dangerous, for reasons of vanity or appearance, not for some sort of, I mean, not that the money-making makes it perfect or great, but they take these drugs for reasons of vanity and appearance, and they endanger their health, potentially, for no good reason.
[23:16] I'd honestly argue that your average juicer is still going to be healthier than your average Joe. But that's a false comparison. Even if it's not ideal for health, they're still probably healthier than most people who don't even exercise or lift.
[23:33] Yeah, but that's not what you would compare it to. You would compare it to people who lift without steroids. Because it's a false dichotomy.
[23:42] Where does your obsession lead you to?
[23:44] It's a false dichotomy to say your choice is to not exercise at all, and I'm only going to compare people who don't exercise at all to people who exercise using dangerous drugs.
[23:58] Obviously, there are more categories, yeah.
[24:02] Yeah, there's the category of people who exercise without using dangerous drugs, right?
[24:05] And then there's people who use other drugs, like rec drugs that you've criticized earlier, who aren't complete junkies. Depending on how much usage counts as a junkie. So, I would say
[24:19] Who has to fully find their body. I mean, I didn't use the word junkie.
[24:23] All right. But this is also my point as well. Sorry, what is? Oh, that there's people who, let's say, that do use rec drugs who, let's say, I wouldn't necessarily say that they fall into that category as well.
[24:47] Sorry, what category?
[24:49] Of like the random drug user who insults people.
[24:56] Okay, and?
[24:59] I mean, that's kind of my own point, that there's like far more arguments for drug usage, such as like as a nootropic stack, people use that as an argument.
[25:09] I don't know what nootropic stack means.
[25:12] A nootropic means like a smart drug. So caffeine might count as a smart drug, but some people don't count it as that. I'd say a better example of a smart drug would be dihexa. So dihexa it's an experimental brain growing peptide, I've tried it and I'm surprised it's not banned by WADA because I'm like this thing should be because it significantly increases my reaction time and I'll find myself answering questions before I even ask them to myself and my working memory goes through the roof and this thing literally increases my own IQ score so it's used to treat let's say spinal damage in mice Alzheimer's etc
[25:59] You mean Alzheimer's in people not in mice right.
[26:02] Yeah but okay it has in like lab studies okay yeah so like You've heard of nootropic supplements, have you?
[26:13] I mean, I've heard of nootropics. So what you're saying is they are beneficial drugs, benevolent drugs, drugs with only, well, all drugs have negative and positive outcomes.
[26:24] Well, most of them are just supplements. So a lot of them, they might, at best, they're going to improve your focus. I'd say a vast majority of them.
[26:36] So why would you need drugs to improve your focus?
[26:39] Why do you use caffeine? That helps improve your focus and it helps you feel more energized. Do you feel that caffeine
[26:48] Is a powerful drug?
[26:51] Yes, it is. It's much more powerful than most vitamin shop, over-the-counter nootropics as well.
[26:59] Okay. All right.
[27:01] It's more powerful than ginkgo biloba. It's more powerful than, I would say, alpha-GPC.
[27:10] Okay, so you would put a cup or two of coffee a day, that would be a drug addict?
[27:17] If you have to, then you're an addict. Whereas, this is my thing when it comes to being an addict or not. Do you function without it or do you not? Like, do you use this thing as a crutch? If it's not a crutch, then you're not an addict. If it is a crutch, then you are.
[27:35] Okay, so then the people who are doing the steroids are addicts.
[27:45] A lot of them What do
[27:48] You mean, they can't lift their weights without it? What are you talking about? What do you mean a lot of them?
[27:53] You're not wrong
[27:55] It's not that I'm wrong, I'm going with your definition I mean.
[27:59] You're not wrong, I would say This is why I don't do gear Well, also because it's like... No, I just...
[28:04] So everybody who needs the drug to function is an addict, right?
[28:09] Yes, I do agree with you here.
[28:12] Okay, so the people who take these performance-enhancing drugs for weightlifting are addicts?
[28:19] Yes.
[28:20] Okay. And the people who take drugs because they want to focus and they really can't focus as well without those drugs are addicts?
[28:29] It depends on how poor their performance is. Can they focus at all without it?
[28:35] Everyone can focus a little bit.
[28:37] Yeah, that's my point when it comes down to that.
[28:45] Yeah, I'm sorry. I mean, I just find it completely ridiculous that you would put a cup or two of coffee in the realm of a powerful drug that people are addicted to.
[28:53] I mean, I'm not comparing that to amphetamines.
[28:56] Okay, so let's just drop it.
[28:58] It's not important. If someone microdoses amphetamines, which they could use, like, experimentally, like, I'm not going to tell people not to do that.
[29:06] Sorry, not to do what?
[29:07] Like if someone were to decide to use roughly like a few milligrams of amphetamines as like an experimental thing to help focus, that's probably not going to cause them to be an addict and then still be able to function even when they crash off of it a little bit.
[29:32] Okay. I can't judge these things. So, sorry. Is there any other philosophical questions that you have?
[29:37] Yes, yes. I would just say that a lot of these cultural issues that you kind of find yourself arguing with lately...
[29:44] Sorry, what do you mean by cultural issues?
[29:46] Like drug usage, things of that nature, natalism. A lot of that stuff's just opinion. And I'll notice this a lot with the... I'd say with libertarians, like... Generally, it's like the more right you go, the more disagreement there is.
[30:03] I think I don't, I don't, you know, this is a philosophy show. So just saying shit doesn't mean anything. Well, they're all just opinions. You know, you kind of have to make a case for that. I mean, all of the drugs that you've taken to improve your concentration and your focus and hasn't helped you reason at all. I mean, art of the, hang on, art, hang on, hang on, art of the, hang on, hang on, hang on, art of the argument.com. You should get that book. It will teach you how to reason. Because just saying stuff is really boring. Because it doesn't produce anything other than, I like ice cream. I think you're wrong.
[30:41] These are all just opinions. Like, it doesn't actually have any intellectual content. You're just making bleating sounds with your mouth hole. And I would actually like to get into a debate with sort of facts, reason, and evidence. And we've had a little bit of that. But you just say stuff, and then you bring up libertarianism. And it's like, I have put forward the argument about, let's say, having children. I put forward a whole series of arguments that need to be addressed and dismissed if you want to participate in a rational conversation. You can't just say, well, it's all just opinion. I mean, you can say it, but then you've just ejected yourself from the realm of competent discourse among adults, right? So I'm going to move on to the next caller, but, you know, artoftheargument.com, I would really, really recommend. It probably is going to do you a whole lot better in your life than whatever micro dosing is going on. Cause I'm telling you, man, that ain't working. All right. Thanks, man. I appreciate it. Nico, Nico, Nico, Nico, you are on the air.
[31:42] How goes it, Stefan? Thanks for having me.
[31:45] My pleasure. What's up with you?
[31:48] Oh, not much. I was, I'm kind of trying to figure out what exactly the conversation around drugs and your philosophy is on it. I saw a couple of your tweets earlier today. I haven't really nailed down exactly what your point is. Could you spell it out for me?
[32:05] What do you mean, my point regarding what?
[32:07] Drug usage.
[32:09] What kind of drugs are we talking about?
[32:11] Marijuana. We'll go with that, for example.
[32:14] Okay. So, marijuana. Look, I understand that for some people, especially if you're going through chemotherapy, marijuana can help with nausea and things like that. So, clearly, I'm not talking about direct medicinal uses of the drug. Can we sort of agree on that?
[32:31] Oh, absolutely. I was more interested on the actual, like, addictive behavior side of things.
[32:39] So, drugs offer a shortcut that is non-communicable and non-reproducible, and therefore, kind of false. So, if you have, let's say, a problem with anxiety, and marijuana calms your anxiety, you don't know why. All you've done is suppressed the symptoms. You haven't dealt with the root causes of the anxiety. I mean, for instance, you might be in danger. You might have people around you who are plotting your downfall or who are going to sabotage your life or who are negative towards whatever it is that you're doing, in which case the anxiety is best dealt with by, of course.
[33:23] Finding a way to reform those people or not having them in your life. You know, if you're, I said this in the show today, if you're being chased by a bear through the woods, that's not the time to say, hey man, I really need to calm my anxiety by smoking a bowl or something like that, right? I mean, you need to deal with the bear. So as far as drugs go, they cover up symptoms and you don't get to root causes. They give you a feeling of knowledge, wisdom, and insight that isn't real. And again, I've said this in my first tweet, I've spent 40 years asking people, and I've asked hundreds of people now, and many of them on this very show, when people call in and say, well, I've had these drugs, I take these drugs, I get all these insights, and I say, well, tell me an insight, and they never come up with anything. So it gives you the illusion of insight, the illusion of wisdom, and it gives you the illusion of a kind of peace of mind and security that you haven't earned through the judicious application, of virtue and integrity, moral courage, and so on to confront the bad people around you and and all of that. And so it covers up the symptoms usually of child abuse, and it doesn't have people deal with their issues in a consistent moral manner. It gives people the feeling of wisdom and knowledge and insight, which isn't real. And of course, once you have that feeling, you tend not to look as much, right? Like if you're driving home, when you get home, you stop driving, right? So if you have this insight, oh man, I get this connection, I get this, I get that, then you kind of stop looking because you think you've already achieved it, but it's an illusion.
[34:47] It's an illusion. It's sort of like if you could, if you still have a bear chasing you, but you can will yourself not to see it or hear it or smell it, you're in really big danger because you can't even see the bear anymore. And so, uh, that is sort of my, some of my major concerns, if that makes sense.
[35:04] Yeah, I definitely agree with all you, with all of that. Um, my, line of questioning is a little more on because I use personally, I would call myself an addict.
[35:18] I'm sorry, what?
[35:20] An addict.
[35:21] Okay.
[35:25] I struggle to find major detrimental effects. I don't really use it to run away from anything. I more just use it lightly but consistently for a mild euphoria like I'm not trying to not feel bad if that makes sense
[35:53] Okay, and what was your childhood like?
[35:56] Oh, terrible. I've dealt with that to the point where it's really in the hands of other people to take some sort of step. I've done everything I could on my side, like offered to go to therapy, offered to pay for therapy, um laid out my problems just logically exactly what i was angry about my childhood like with that to the point that i can personally and it's not something that i feel emotionally affects me that much it does from time to time birthdays and holidays i might get a little melancholic.
[36:49] And sorry, you don't have to give me your exact age, but what decade are you in?
[36:54] Oh, I give you my age. I don't mind. I'm 37.
[36:57] Okay. And what were the issues? I'm very sorry to hear about your childhood, my friend, but what were the issues in your childhood?
[37:05] Abuse and neglect.
[37:08] I'm sorry about that. What kind of abuse?
[37:12] Primarily physical um my mom just she didn't really care like she was not malicious but she was neglectful and she didn't have a problem with physical punishment
[37:28] And how bad did that get.
[37:29] Oh it got pretty bad quite a bit i think my uh my most prominent memory of it was um she used to have this gaudy belt with this large like lion belt buckle and it actually had like sharp teeth on it and it would leave little fang marks in my ass um was
[37:52] It bare skin yeah.
[37:55] No, it was usually through underwear. I usually didn't get my underwear pulled down, but I'd get my pants pulled down by my mom. My father would spank me too, but that didn't really affect me because when I look back on it after having a lot of realizations, my dad was a deadbeat loser pot dealer. He still lives with his father. And yeah he's he's never amounted to anything he's he's a piece of work but i've also dealt with that to the point where i can where he's just pretty much cut off but the doors open if he wants to change uh my mother's just completely cut off but the rest of that memory with the belt is i remember crawling under a a waterbed frame you know with the ones that have like the dressers on the sides, but they're all down the middle. I was trying to escape through the middle of it to just basically get away. I remember just being dragged out of that and felt it quite a bit. That was all just because I took 50 cents out of my mother's purse to buy a little frozen Popeye's in elementary school.
[39:16] Right. Just horrible. Just horrible. And you got in combination with the spankings and the beatings, you had neglect. is that right.
[39:24] Yeah like she didn't i was i was a latchkey kid pretty early on like probably around 14 um it was my older brother's job to take care of me and my younger brother um he didn't so i took it upon myself and did best i could i made a lot of hamburger helpers for dinners and
[39:50] And how was it in your teenage years?
[39:54] That's when I really started using to escape without knowing it. Like, once I was in about sophomore year, I discovered marijuana, and it was pretty much just the rest of high school. It didn't really affect my academic performance. I'm a hyper-intelligent person. And I've got a really high IQ. I've also got Asperger's syndrome, though, so that's a little bit correlated. It's taken me a long time to learn how to speak to people and read social cues and so on and so forth. But yeah, I have an interesting relationship with marijuana now. I think about it critically and not so much philosophically, and I taper off of it from time to time. Uh it's not something that like financially impacts me too much i spend maybe a hundred dollars a month on it and
[41:00] What about your dating life.
[41:03] Oh, it's non-existent at this point because I'm trying to just build myself up.
[41:09] Well, I mean, bro, you're 37, right? It's not like you've got a long runway.
[41:13] Oh, yeah, I know. Like, I'm very aware of that. I'm working very fast to build myself up.
[41:20] What has your dating history been?
[41:25] Unwitting serial monogamy. like for like i've only had about seven long-term relationships uh the longest one was uh four and a half years that one was probably that one was my first like real long-term relationship that like really crushed me afterwards because i was stepdad in the situation and
[41:50] So you were what.
[41:51] A stepdad a
[41:53] Stepdad oh my gosh so you had a four and a half how old are you.
[41:57] At that point, I believe I was 21,
[42:00] 22 So you're 21 or 22 And you had a four and a half year relationship With a single mom?
[42:06] Yeah, not the best decision in retrospect
[42:08] How
[42:09] Old was she?
[42:10] She was my age
[42:13] And how many, did she just have one kid or more?
[42:15] No, she had two kids
[42:16] Two kids from the same dad? Yeah And where was he?
[42:21] He was another city about like 90 miles away with another girl that he had knocked up he had like a pill popping addiction and that went into a whole debacle that just created so much chaos in my life because her ex basically I really bonded with these kids they started calling me dad they started calling their father by his first name that really pissed me him off um We were also having issues with their grandmother beating them whenever they would go over to their father's. They would come back with bruises and grip marks. I know, looking back, I should have done something so far as getting the authorities involved, but their mother basically just wanted to keep everything without the authorities.
[43:27] Why does she have children with such a guy?
[43:33] Um, I never really got into it.
[43:36] Like, I, and what was your attraction to her?
[43:40] I was young, stupid and horny.
[43:43] So she was just relatively attractive and sexually available.
[43:47] Yeah. I mean, she, she spent time with me. Like we shared a lot of the same hobbies. Um, like I wasn't old enough to think that like you need to be ideologically matched with your mate and stuff. I was a couple years out of high school and discovering the world and learning how to be and failing miserably at it.
[44:10] And how did that relationship end?
[44:13] Oh, so eventually when the kids started calling me dad and their dad by their first name, his immediate reaction was to use the physical evidence of the beatings from their grandmother to try and accuse me of both physically and sexually abusing both of the children.
[44:38] Oh, yeah. God, how appalling.
[44:41] Yeah, long story short, that basically immediately got the authorities involved. I was removed from the house. I was homeless for probably about six months. The court case went on for like 14 months until the kids' father's current wife found out he was cheating on her and also that he had made this entire thing up because he told her when he was cheating on her. He was really high and they were fighting. So she showed up at the next court thing, spilled everything to the Judd, got Child Protective Services involved. They lost the kids, thank God, because I did my best to prepare and properly discipline those kids. Because even back then, I was listening to you. You were my introduction.
[45:37] Well, not that much.
[45:40] Well like even back then i was listening to you enough to like i had bought peaceful parenting back then
[45:46] Well no no the peaceful parenting that's not true that just came out recently, when like 15 years ago that did i mean i was talking about it but i wasn't i hadn't written the book i.
[45:57] Really talked about it a lot though sure was it was it just on your youtube then
[46:02] It was on youtube um it was in my podcasts um yeah i talked about it a lot but the book wasn't now but it's neither here nor there so you were but you didn't listen to the uh dangers of dating a single mom show okay yeah.
[46:13] I probably just didn't adhere to them
[46:15] Okay no that's fine some people can read the diet book without changing their diet that that happens yeah okay so that was i mean my god what did you do when you were homeless i mean that's it's terrifying like.
[46:27] I kept working i lived in my car um I had my cat with me because she wouldn't keep my cat, and I didn't want my cat to go. So I basically created a partition between the front seat and the back seat and bought a couple window air conditioners so you could put in there. It was a horrible situation for six months, but I never lost my job throughout the process. I got back on my feet. I got an apartment, the court case ended, and then I fell into another stupid relationship.
[47:11] Should I ask, or is that too terrifying a story?
[47:15] No, the explanation I gave you there was really the worst. After that, it was just, like, I picked bad women because I didn't know what to look for. Like, nobody ever...
[47:28] No, no, no, no, come on, come on. You had already been listening. Hang on. Hang on. Don't, don't, don't play victim with me, bro. You had access to at least what I do and I'm a student and other people do. So we were saying, you know, choose for virtue, right? Love is our involuntary response to virtue if we're virtuous. So you can't go rubber bones. If you have access to better information, that doesn't mean you follow it. Lord knows I've had access to better information and not followed it, but I wouldn't claim that I was ignorant.
[47:56] Right. That's fair. Like that's, it's not an accurate representation on my part and thanks for correcting me
[48:03] No that's fine so what was the problem with the next relationship um.
[48:07] Like if i had to put the problem on like the next four relationships it's really i i didn't want to be alone more than anything so
[48:19] Like no but that's the problem within you but what was the problem i mean just you can give me a brief synopsis of the next couple of relationships what the major issues were because obviously they didn't last, right?
[48:30] No, I've always had long-term relationships in between one and three years. I've had... I haven't even thought of them for a while. I used to know these statistics, but it's something I generally don't worry about anymore.
[48:48] Well, are you in a relationship now?
[48:50] No. Like I said, I've been... I haven't been focused on it. I haven't been prioritizing it.
[48:58] Okay. When was the last relationship that you were in? And appreciate this information. Thank you for sharing. When was the last relationship that you were in? And what happened?
[49:09] It was about, uh, it ended two years ago. It lasted for about a year and a half.
[49:16] Okay.
[49:17] Um, girl I met online, uh,
[49:23] And this is after 15 years of philosophy, right?
[49:26] Yeah.
[49:27] So this should have been much better.
[49:32] It was a lot more tumultuous, but I was more focused on making it better.
[49:39] What was tumultuous about it?
[49:41] I tried to engage with her logically and philosophically.
[49:46] What was tumultuous about it?
[49:48] Uh we had some major disagreements on abortion okay
[49:54] I mean so you have intellectual disagreements moral disagreements yeah is that the tumultuous thing that you're talking about or was this something else.
[50:01] No it's just like we would we would fight over stupid little things um
[50:08] Well no no abortion is not a stupid little thing so i'm not sure i follow that.
[50:12] Well like yeah i was getting into it like we would fight about like stupid little things and like how you have like your little tiffs in relationships but that they never really came to a resolution on her side for some reason like she always felt like I don't know she wasn't winning and like a lot of it was good but like one day like she just up and left and all my shit was on my doorstep and
[50:51] Oh and there wasn't any big conflict beforehand she just didn't want it.
[50:55] There were minor conflicts beforehand no
[50:58] That's why I said it was there a big conflict I get the minor conflict was there a big conflict.
[51:06] I don't know. I think one of the biggest things was I tried to... It really upset her how much I talked about the political world and where it was at the time being. And I don't know. I tried to have logical conversations with her on the things that we disagreed on. Mostly from the point of this is why you're wrong within a logical structure, but she just get angrier and angrier. I don't know if I was trying too hard to convince her and mold her into something she wasn't.
[51:51] Were you doing drugs over the course of this relationship?
[51:56] No. I've been off for quite a while before that. I picked it up a little bit again after that and kind of been going with it, but not a whole lot.
[52:14] So if you've dealt, and I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm just trying to understand that one of the ways in which you know that you've truly dealt with childhood issues is you can sustain a healthy relationship. So if you tell me, well, and that's why I asked you about relationships. It's not a total rule. It's just my particular opinion. But it's, you know, the two big things, right? Work and love, particularly for men, work and love. You have a career, it sounds like. You kept your job even while homeless. So obviously, you're very good at what you do. But if you're not, hang on. But if you're not, I'm sorry, go ahead.
[52:47] I said I also own my own business as well.
[52:49] Oh, congratulations. That's exciting.
[52:51] I was in a car accident about a year and a half ago. That's what I'm rebuilding towards financially right now.
[52:57] Oh, you were in a car accident?
[52:59] Yeah, someone had hit me. I'm a house painter, and I was in my work van. I still have my personal vehicle, but I don't have anything to move equipment to, so I can't take jobs. But I also still have a full-time job where I'm working like 12 hours a day trying to work towards that.
[53:16] Sorry um you're if you're a house painter and somebody invites you into a dusty esky novel don't go uh okay so you work hard um but you're not able to sustain a healthy relationship right, so far yeah.
[53:32] So far i think i'm able to now um i'm just i think i could tell you like they're Like, I'm looking, I'm actively trying, but it's really hard to find a woman who's even ideologically aligned with me enough to approach.
[53:55] Well, let's look at you from the standpoint of a wise woman, right? So a wise woman, I assume she's in her 30s or whatever. So when a wise woman looks at you and your dating history, what does she see?
[54:11] Seven, she sees a serial monogamous, which is not a good thing.
[54:17] Right. She, she sees that you have made unwise choices in who you date, right? So if you say to her, I fully dealt with my childhood, but the evidence is that at least up until two years ago, you were still making very unwise choices about who you date. She won't believe you. She won't believe that you've dealt with your childhood if in your mid-30s you're still making terrible choices about who to date.
[54:47] Yeah.
[54:48] So, don't say that.
[54:53] Don't say what?
[54:55] Don't say that you fully dealt with all your childhood issues if in your mid-30s you were still making bad decisions about relationships, really bad decisions, and And you didn't even end the relationship. You got dumped hard, right? She just tossed your stuff out on the sidewalk. And so it wasn't even like you came to some realization two years ago that you had some epiphany about how badly you were choosing women in relationships. She kicked you out. So you didn't even wake up to that aspect of things, right?
[55:27] Well, I mean, like I said, it was tumultuous beforehand. Like, I just, I didn't see it coming, like, though it was obvious.
[55:34] No, no, I understand that. I understand that. So, let me give you an analogy, since you're into the business world, right? So, if someone comes to you, and they have started seven businesses that have all failed, some catastrophically, right? Some where they get sued or end up in court, right? And they come to you and they say, I want you to invest $5 million in my next business. What is the investor going to say?
[56:03] Probably some expletives.
[56:05] He's going to say hell no, right? Now, how do you get, because of course you're asking a woman to tie her life together with yours. So how do you get an investor to invest in your business after seven pretty catastrophic failures?
[56:25] Well, you'd have to somehow like rebuild your credit and your merit.
[56:31] So, no, I get all of that. But how? I mean, that's that's like saying, how do you make money in business? Well, the important thing is to have your cost be lower than your than your income. Okay, but so how do you have, hang on, how do you have credibility with a quality woman if she looks at a string of, and the fact that you had seven relationships is not the end of the world, but they were pretty bad, right? So, and into your mid-30s. So how do you have credibility with a quality woman?
[57:01] Suppose that's the question I'm seeking the answer to.
[57:04] So I can tell you, I can tell you one thing you don't do is you say I fully dealt with my childhood issues.
[57:10] Fair. I won't do that anymore then.
[57:13] Well, and it can't be true. First of all, it's impossible to fully deal. I don't even know what that would mean. Because to fully deal with your childhood issues would be almost like to be who you were as if they hadn't happened, which is impossible. Right? They'll always have an effect. They'll always have a shadow. My childhood still casts a shadow on my life from time to time. I think I've tried to judo it into, you know, having suffered a lot of evil as a child. I have tried to judo that into spreading as much good and virtue as possible. And having experienced a lot of violence, I've tried to judo that into counseling parents to not use violence against their children. So I think I've done as much good as I can with the evils that I suffered. But I wouldn't be doing what I'm doing if I'd had a happy childhood. So even I wouldn't even be having this conversation with you in this studio if I'd had a happy childhood. So saying I fully dealt with my childhood is not going to be believed by a wise woman because it's kind of not possible, if that makes sense. right.
[58:13] I guess I should clarify like what I mean because I was trying to specify that I've dealt with it in so far as I can where without other people being involved like if my mother offered to reconcile it'd be very hard for me but I would work towards it I don't think my father would like my father thinks I'm a Russian spy and i don't know why he he went off the deep
[58:47] Well i assume that if you're somewhat conservative then you're aligned with trump and trump is a russian asset therefore you're a russian spy i assume it's something like that yeah.
[58:55] Something like that but like i wouldn't call myself a trump supporter like i would call myself a conservative
[59:00] No i said aligned with i didn't say a supporter okay all right so i would say um keep plugging away and um don't don't do drugs because a quality woman does she want a guy who smokes weed a lot probably not well no of course not of course not because i don't know does it have effects on your sperm it's not going to have an effect on your parenting it's going to have like she won't know if you're she won't know who you are if you're on drugs a lot. So she'll just like, so if you say, well, I've dealt with my childhood, I want a quality relationship, I'm working towards it, and I'm doing a lot of marijuana. No, that's not going to work, right?
[59:41] So you'd recommend just cutting it out completely?
[59:45] Well, I, you know, I mean, obviously talk to your doctor or I don't know what the withdrawal stuff would be like. I'm just saying that if you want a quality woman, a quality woman does not want a drug addict. I'll just tell you that straight up. Especially a guy in his late 30s. Like, you know, you're not far off from pushing 40, right? And so if you're still using weed and you've had a whole string of bad relationships and you're claiming that you've dealt with your childhood completely and you're still using weed, you are not going to come across as credible to a quality woman. So, I don't think it's worth it to keep doing the weed if you want to get married and have kids or have a quality relationship. For sure.
[1:00:26] Sounds like you're trying to transition over. I just have one more quick question. It's a little tangential. What's your opinion on nicotine? I think it is actually one of the things you could put in the category of it's an addictive substance, but it can be beneficial because it's neuroprotective.
[1:00:46] Yeah, I mean, nicotine has some significant benefits with regards to concentration and focus and all of that sort of stuff. Do I particularly, I mean, obviously smoking is bad. I have no idea what the health effects are of nicotine gum or anything like that, but I would not put that in, you know, the category of, you know, really bad. I mean, again, I don't really know, but, you know, there's mind altering and there's not mind altering. And there's like mind altering in a foundational way. I mean, you can say, you know, sugar is mind altering, oxygen is mind-altering if you have too much of it you get dizzy right so but in terms of like, one of the things for me is can you drive right so you can drive and smoke right you can drive and have a cup of coffee and you're fine not weed not alcohol not hard drugs obviously, not mushrooms right so that's sort of the big difference for me and it's just a it's not 100% but it's kind of like a rule of thumb, that if you can drive safely, it's not that big a deal. And if you can't drive safely, then clearly it's a bigger, much bigger deal. So, uh, that would be my, my thought. All right. I appreciate you, uh, coming by and I wish you the very best going forward. Mrs. Oh, sorry. Ms.
[1:02:03] Callaway. What is on your mind, my friend? Fill my neurons with your are velvet tones. Going once. You need to unmute. Hi, how you doing? I'm well, thanks.
[1:02:24] You never need to apologize for the delightful sounds of children. I think that's lovely. I remember when my daughter first figured out that she could sing well, and she still does, She makes a joyful noise up by the rafters on a daily basis, and it's a beautiful thing. Sorry, go ahead.
[1:02:47] Well, hello. Thanks for letting me come up. I was moved a lot by that person's perspective, so he could do a lot of introspectiveness. We are children at heart, but that means we are little beeps. Everything seems so...
[1:03:09] Hang on, hang on, hang on. Let's start off nice. Are you calling children little beeps?
[1:03:14] No, I'm saying that we take things very personally, all of us, and sometimes it's not that personal. So if we step outside of our minds, we're more able to move past the things that do hurt us, that we think that the whole world's against us when someone calls us certain names instead of thinking of that person only as the bully. That makes sense. Right.
[1:03:42] Okay. I'm with you. We should certainly try and rise above and recognize that when people are insulting you, it almost never has anything to do with you. Exactly. I mean, some people get mad at me on Twitter all the time, and I'm just perfectly aware that it's got nothing to do with me. So people who do a lot of drugs, they're not happy about it. They're not content with it. They really don't think it's that good a thing. And so when I come along and say, drugs are bad, they get mad, and it is their addiction. Really, I would assume it's not even anything to do with me foundationally so it doesn't you know water off a duck's back but so sorry go ahead um.
[1:04:16] My position on drugs is going to be that they're bad okay but as an adult it's uh everything in moderation and i don't need any overlord like please watch yourself so
[1:04:28] So what do you mean by everything in moderation you don't mean like beating people up or uh assaulting children in moderation right there's some stuff which Okay.
[1:04:38] But hey, if you have aggressors in your population, I would probably send them to the military and across the sea rather than unleash them into your place or, you know, the jails would be a good place.
[1:04:53] No, to be a loser.
[1:04:55] ...a year and don't need an outlet is asinine and arrogant.
[1:05:01] I'm sorry you cut out for a second there. I lost you after sending aggressive people into the military.
[1:05:08] I wasn't sending. It's a volunteer by, you know. I would also encourage people who have a trillion dollars to donate some of their money to things that are beyond their means. But I would never ask the government to task people to make sure that that happens.
[1:05:26] Good, good. I mean, I would have some reservations about taking violent criminals and training them how to use weaponry better and how to use squad formations and hand signals that make them look like a basic picture.
[1:05:40] Sorry, I just got a phone call. What did you say? You don't want to train violent people to use weapons.
[1:05:46] I would have some reservations about that, right? I mean, I know that there is criminal gangs who join the military or the police force in order to get, quote, free or paid weapons training and then cycle back out into the criminal element, having learned all of these cool tricks and strategies and so on for
[1:06:04] how to be more effectively violent.
[1:06:05] But anyway, is there anything else that you wanted to mention about drugs?
[1:06:13] Sorry, I lost you the last 30 seconds.
[1:06:16] Okay, I think we're going to have to drop you. No offense. I appreciate that, but I think that your connection is not good enough. Roger. Roger. If you want to unmute and tell me what's on your mind. Hello, hello. Going once, going twice. I think he just muted himself. Hello, Ned? Yes, sir, go ahead.
[1:06:47] Okay, so since you mentioned resolving childhood issues a bit earlier, do these in general involve kind of forgiving our parents if we perceive that they did something wrong and move on with our lives? Is that the general gist of it? Or is there some details that can vary from family to family, in your understanding?
[1:07:19] Well, I wouldn't say that we should hold people at fault if we simply perceive that they've done something wrong. The question is, did they objectively do something wrong, often even by their own standards? So I wouldn't say it's the perception. So can you give me an example of a wrong that a parent would do to a child that would require forgiveness? That's not just a child's perception, but something that would be more objectively wrong.
[1:07:46] Oh, okay. So it could be, for instance, negligence. The parents maybe, for example, do drugs and they don't care about their children, so their children grow without so much care as they could if the parents were sober all the time,
[1:08:05] For instance. Okay, so the parents chose to do drugs. They didn't go for treatment. They didn't get help. They didn't do therapy. And they didn't give up the children, which you can do. Like, I don't know if everybody knows this, but certainly in some places in the world, you can drop your kids off at a police station or a fire station or a hospital, and your kids will try to provide decent homes for your kids and so on. So they kept the kids around. They did drugs. They didn't get treatment. And the children end up neglected in pretty significant ways. Is that the scenario? you?
[1:08:34] Yeah, that's the scenario. Okay.
[1:08:38] So, the question of forgiveness is, has the person earned it? Has the person earned forgiveness? Now, earning forgiveness is a three-part process. The first thing, of course, is you need the apology. The second thing you need is some kind of restitution. And the third thing you need is a reasonable assurance that steps are being Taken so that it's not going to happen again I.
[1:09:02] Would say you need awareness too That it happened
[1:09:08] Well, I think that's kind of a, I think that's kind of a given, right? So I asked about, you know, what would be a wrong, that it's not just a child's perception, but an objective fact. So just stay with me. It is, it is already accepted that this has gone wrong. So the analogy would be if I borrow your car and I put a big dent in the door, right? So if I just say, hey, sorry, man, and I dropped the car back and walk off, well, I haven't fixed the car, right? I haven't, you know, made the restitution. And if it turned out that I dinged your car because I drove drunk, even if I said sorry, and I paid for the car to get fixed, maybe a couple of extra bucks for your trouble, and then I kept drinking, you wouldn't lend me your car again. So the question is, are we back to a state where the person has been made whole, they're not happy that it happened, but they're not unhappy that it happened. So let's say I ding your car, it's, you know, 200 bucks to fix. And I give you, I take you out for lunch as well for your inconvenience. So you're not happy that I dinged your car. You're not unhappy. It's okay. That's a neutral. You don't want someone to be overjoyed because then you're overcompensating. Like, oh, I dinged your car. Here's half a million dollars. They'll be like, here, here's more cars you can ding. That's too much.
[1:10:22] So you have to have the apology. You have to have the restitution. And then you have to have some reasonable assurance that it's not going to happen again. So if I'm dating some girl and I yell at her and I take a glass and I throw it against the wall, you know, acting out some crazy rage. I obviously need to apologize. I need to make restitution, right? So I need to fix whatever I broke. And I also need to enroll in therapy or anger management classes or something like that. So she has some reasonable assurance that it's not going to happen again. Does that make sense so far?
[1:10:57] Yeah, yeah, it does. And if I may, can I go back to the scenario of the parents, actually, to compare with this car analogy that you made?
[1:11:05] Sure.
[1:11:07] Okay, so suppose that the child has grown and is an adult and is fully aware
[1:11:14] that the parents did wrong in regards to their child-rearing life.
[1:11:22] And now there's two possibilities or the parents are still alive or they are dead and so the parents being dead pretty much guarantees that no further problems will happen so I think that would solve the forgiveness part No,
[1:11:44] No, no, no not even a bit because the parents never apologized and they never made restitution.
[1:11:54] Yeah so uh but if they are still alive we would need to confront them uh explicitly saying okay this happened do you acknowledge it do you uh acknowledge it to the point that you ask for forgiveness and stop doing wrong to me even as an adult is well you
[1:12:19] Hang on hang on You skipped over one step, which is actually quite telling.
[1:12:25] No, go ahead.
[1:12:27] Restitution. So if you grew up in filth and squalor because your parents were drug addicts and refused to get help and refused to give you up to people who could take care of you better, if they kept you trapped at home like prisoners, like animals, then what would restitution look like? What could be restitution for that? What would make that okay?
[1:12:49] That's a good question.
[1:12:51] I don't think anything. like this is why you shouldn't let things fester you shouldn't let things get bad, right so if you do wrong which we all do we all stumble and and sort of make uh make errors and sometimes we can be pompous or whatever it is right well we all make mistakes so you don't want to let these things fester you want to as quickly as possible make restitution and make it right because if children grew up with like 20 years of being neglected and and didn't have enough food and no health care and so on there's nothing that can be done to make that okay there's nothing. Nothing that can be done to make that okay.
[1:13:26] And you can replace the example, which is one among many forms of mistreatment of children by their parents, with child abuse, physical aggression, yelling, educating poorly, indoctrinating in a way that their minds become closed, so many things that people that are raised in such abusive manners, and probably there are an abundance in the population of people that unfortunately did not have an optimum childhood, there's a lot of restitution that is impossible, according to what you said.
[1:14:14] Right. And this is why... The parents, did the parents ever have, and this is why I said it's really by the parent's own standard, so did the parent ever say to the child, you pushed your brother off the desk, and so you need to say you're sorry, you need to apologize, right? You stole your sister's candy and ate it in the cupboard under the stairs, you need to go and apologize to her, right? So did the parents have, as a moral standard they imposed upon the children, the need to apologize on wrongdoing. Now, if the parents had that standard, and most parents do, if the parents had the standard that if you do wrong, you need to apologize when you're four or five or three or eight or ten or whatever it is, then the parents in their 30s and 40s should apologize as well. But if they didn't, this is the big challenge. This is why I'm constantly telling parents, if you do wrong, if you've done wrong, apologize to your children before it's too late. Because there absolutely is a too late. And the too late is when restitution becomes impossible. Now, let's say that you're 25 and your parents are 55.
[1:15:28] And you've been an adult for seven years. You go and talk to your parents about if you were this kid who was neglected as a result of drug use and so on. You go and talk to your parents, but they can't parent you anymore because you're an adult. So you'd go and talk to your parents. Maybe you'd get an apology. Maybe you'd get some restitution. It wouldn't be enough, obviously. Maybe you'd get some commitment about how it wasn't going to happen again.
[1:15:55] But they still can't parent you because by going to your parents with this knowledge, you're showing that you're much more mature than they are. You're much more responsible. You're much more moral. You're much wiser. You're much more honest than they are. So you're 25 and you're wiser, smarter, more honorable, more honest, have greater integrity, better communicator. Your parents are 55 and still complete idiots and corrupt this way. Are you going to spend the rest of your life trying to parent your parents? That's not going to work. So what is the relationship? And I don't have a good answer for this, just so you know, but what is the relationship that you could have with, I mean, I confronted my mother, late 20s, late 20s, maybe into my early 30s. I had a whole series of conversations. And I didn't get apologies. I got mushy, blamed the doctor who poisoned her or whatever it was. It doesn't really matter. So I didn't get even apologies. But what restitution, what restitution would.
[1:16:51] Make my childhood okay. Well, there is no restitution that would make my childhood okay. I mean, I've tried to get the best out of it, as I mentioned earlier, that I can, but there's no restitution that would make my childhood okay.
[1:17:03] So, without restitution, what happens? Well, you know, there could be a farewell conversation, like I just need you to know these things, but I can't raise you. You're my parents. I can't teach you. I can't instruct you on basic honesty, basic human decency, or anything like that. I can't train you or teach you, because then what happens is you suffer as a result of your parents being immature, corrupt, or downright evil when you're a child, and then you also suffer by trying to parent them, and fix them now that they're adults. And all of that, right, what happened to you, which was harmful as a child, is bad for your adult romantic relationships and work relationships. And how much energy are you going to have to fall in love with a good quality woman who comes from a good quality family, or even if she doesn't, she's a good quality woman. And you say, well, my major project for the next 30 years is to fix my parents, to bring my parents who are cruel to me as children to reason, love, and virtue, which is probably impossible anyway. So you end up then having your childhood half destroyed by your parents, and then your romantic life as an adult half destroyed by your parents, or rather your mission to try and fix them or change them or make them better. And then you go through the whole, well, they're manipulating, they pretend, and then they back down or they back off. So it really does not seem to me a very productive.
[1:18:27] Line to go down. Again, this is assuming that the abuse was pretty egregious and your parents didn't try and fix anything until fairly significantly into your adulthood. I don't really see what the plus is. I think it's then time to perhaps withdraw your losses or cut your losses and try and focus on having a quality relationship and making a better family out of the wreckage of your unchosen family. Because the family you have is the family you choose, the family you make. The family you're born into is not the family you choose. And if you can't fix what you didn't choose, you can try and make things better in where you can choose, if that makes sense.
[1:19:04] Yeah, in regards to this, a technique from Stoicism came to mind, which is fatalism. But not fatalism, broadly regarding time, just regarding the past and the present. So the past has already happened, we cannot change it, absolutely. The present in which we are located is pretty much also locked in place. But we can change our vector towards the future in meaningful ways especially if we focus on stuff that we actually have some power on and if we find ourselves having been raised, born and raised or misraised in a family that is egregious term used and we have had no say in that we had no control because we were children minors and we survive that. We gain some wisdom somehow through life or our peers or teachers. There are other role models, fortunately, beyond parents that might actually inject some wisdom in young people. And so probably some people will realize that the best thing to do is actually to stop their relationship with really bad parents and move on with their lives.
[1:20:29] Yeah, I mean, the concept of no-fault divorce has been accepted by society, and these are relationships that you choose. These are relationships that involve helpless children, which adult children with their parents doesn't involve helpless children. So we have this whole thing about how you should just be able to leave your marriage if you're just dissatisfied. That's no problem. It's self-actualization. But it's funny, because when it comes to parents, which people didn't choose, everybody kind of loses their minds about this kind of stuff. And it's, of course, it's just power and parents can be scary. All right. Let's do one or two more. Barcode. Thank you for the questions. Great, great questions. Barcode. I'm not going to make any scanning jokes, but maybe a QR jokes. Quality relationships, QR. That's what we need. If you want to unmute, I'm happy to hear your thoughts.
[1:21:17] Hello, can you hear me?
[1:21:18] Yes, go ahead.
[1:21:20] So, in regards to all this drug stuff, I hope I don't qualify as a druggie for one use of psilocybin, you know, over a decade ago.
[1:21:31] The druggies, sorry, the druggies, just to be clear, the druggies are the people who say it's cool and positive and great. Other people should try it it's this uh as opposed to you know like uh if if i uh have surgery and they they use local anesthetic i don't say man you should really try local anesthetic it's the greatest thing ever i'm just like well i needed that for you know the surgery or whatever so the druggies it's not really the number of times you do it it's whether you promote it that that to me is the key but go ahead all.
[1:21:58] Right so i think we're aligned in that i wouldn't promote any sort of drug use as beneficial broad scale. But anecdotally, I was in a pretty rotten place with anxiety and depression for a little bit there. And I tried talk therapy, cognitive behavioral therapy, things like that. And I don't know, be it arrogance and younger age or whatever, it really didn't have an effect on me. It wasn't really helping. I could sort of negative logic my way around whatever the therapist was trying to
[1:22:30] Say okay but hang on so did you what were your relationships like at this how old were you when you were going through this anxiety and depression maybe 22 23.
[1:22:38] And
[1:22:38] What were your relationships like with your family with siblings with friends with girlfriends.
[1:22:43] I mean i was i had good relationships with my friends who had chosen most of them had gone off to like ivy league schools um and i didn't quite make it so that was part of the depression and anxiety what
[1:22:54] Do you mean you didn't quite make it you wanted to go but you didn't go.
[1:22:56] I I didn't even apply. My SAT score was, you know, a little bit higher than Mindami's. So not quite in the territory of making it to an Ivy League. But, yeah, so, you know, that was all surrounding it.
[1:23:11] I'm sorry, but why were your SATs so low?
[1:23:15] You know, just didn't study as much as I should have, you know.
[1:23:19] Okay, why didn't you study as much? We can keep doing this until you get to a new course.
[1:23:23] We can go into the details of all this. It's really not about my past, you know. I just wasn't as successful as my more intelligent friends. Let's leave it at that.
[1:23:32] So it was a factor of intelligence, because you said you didn't study as much.
[1:23:36] I mean, this and that. You know, I couldn't really tell you. You know, I had near-perfect writing SAT score, high math SAT score. For some reason, I flubbed the reading. But, you know, that happens.
[1:23:48] But you can take it a bunch of times, right?
[1:23:50] Yeah, again, but this is the issue I was having was the depression and anxiety. I was so stressed out with test-taking at the time. It was like the weight, the burden of not getting, you know, a 2400 was crippling to me at the time.
[1:24:05] Sorry was that out of a parental or family expectation or.
[1:24:08] Something yes yes very much so my mom was you know a plus student every single class if you get an a we're going to have a shouting match for hours you know
[1:24:16] That kind of not asian are you asian no.
[1:24:18] No roman catholic you know
[1:24:20] Well it could be both but all right i was just curious if the tiger mom thing was was kicking in okay so you had a mom who was like a perfectionist when it came to studying right was she a perfectionist when it came to parenting? In other words, you're supposed to get perfect SATs. Did she read a whole bunch of books on parenting and how to parent well because she's really into excellence?
[1:24:43] Um, yeah. Yeah. I mean, she was like a PhD biologist. She was like real into like, I'm going to make these like super soldier children and they're going to go on to like,
[1:24:52] You're not answering, you're not answering my question.
[1:24:55] I'm sorry. Could you, do you mind repeating it?
[1:24:58] Well, listen, I have nothing against people who are into excellence, right? I have very high standards for myself. I try to get things right. I try to get the data right. I try to get my arguments right. I've worked very hard to be excellent at philosophy. I have no problem with excellence. That's great. Is it more important to be good at tests or good at parenting? Yeah parenting of course right so if your mother is really into excellence great love it, did she apply the same standard of you've got to be excellent when it came to parenting right so if you're supposed to study for six months or whatever it is or a year for your SATs when she decided to get married and have children, did she also study a lot to be a parent and got really good books and training and coaching and all of that on parenting?
[1:26:00] I don't believe so. I don't think. I wouldn't know, to be honest.
[1:26:05] Well, I think you do know. Sorry to be rude. I apologize. But I think you do know. So, for instance, Do you think it's good parenting to put that much pressure on your children about tests?
[1:26:18] Oh, definitely not. No.
[1:26:19] Okay. So she didn't get any good parenting advice with regards to that. How did she discipline her children when they did things she didn't like?
[1:26:28] It's screaming, yelling, you know.
[1:26:30] Okay. So do you think that there are, and I'm really sorry for that. It's horrible. Particularly that sound of female screaming from moms. It's like nails on a chalkboard. It just, it scours the male soul and makes our balls go back up into our throat. So do you think that there are any parenting books that say, if your children are doing something you don't like, the best remedy is to scream at them?
[1:26:52] Definitely not.
[1:26:53] No. Okay. So she sucked as a parent in these ways. Not be blunt, right? This is terrible parenting. How often did she scream at her children?
[1:27:02] I mean, I was pretty good, but you know, my brothers got the worst of it because they weren't quite so good.
[1:27:08] So I didn't. No, no, no, no. See, this is... How old are you?
[1:27:11] I'm 35.
[1:27:13] Okay, so you should know this shit better by now. Are you really blaming your mother screaming on the children being, quote, bad?
[1:27:19] No, no, I'm not blaming it.
[1:27:20] You just did. You just did. You said, I was good, but my brothers weren't as good, so they got the brunt of it.
[1:27:27] Well, the point only is that, like, I witnessed the consequences.
[1:27:31] No, slow your roll. Slow your roll. Hang on, you're not listening. You're not listening. I'm not saying you've got to agree with me, but you can't just talk as if I didn't say something. You did. You said, and I'm not trying to put you down or blame you for anything like that, but, you know, it seems pretty important, right?
[1:27:50] Absolutely.
[1:27:51] Hang on. Did your mother scream at your brothers because they weren't good?
[1:27:59] Well, qualify good here.
[1:28:02] You used the word. But, I mean, my qualification doesn't mean anything.
[1:28:06] I mean, if they got a B, she would, you know, scream at them, basically.
[1:28:10] Okay. Does getting a B mean you're bad? You're not good?
[1:28:14] No, but it means you're not as good as you could be, or you're not applying yourself.
[1:28:21] Well, how do you know? I mean, not everyone can get A's. It's not a matter of willpower.
[1:28:26] Well, I mean, look at the cultures that kind of assume that their children can. Their children mostly get A's.
[1:28:34] Well, that's not true at all. If you're talking about, say, Asian cultures, they have self-selected for high IQ into the West. So that's a matter. And also, do they get A's in terms of creativity or A's in terms of rote memorization, which is not the same thing at all. I've got a whole show on tiger moms and all of that. So suicidality is high. Mental illness is high. Lack of creativity is very high in that, you know, they can play piano well, but they can't compose for shit, right so um no it is not just a matter of willpower i mean if if the parents are very musical the kids are more likely to be musical but they're not going to be as musical as the parents because of regression to the mean right so there so no it is not just a matter of willpower sorry go ahead i'll.
[1:29:18] Have to look at that tiger mom situation and you definitely you're definitely hitting the nail on the head there's there's serious issues with my upbringing
[1:29:25] Well and sorry to interrupt, but if your mom is really into excellence, then she should have been an excellent parent, and she should have read about how to motivate children, how to reason with children, how to deal with children, because she's obviously very intelligent. You say a PhD. She's very intelligent. And so why the hell would she think that you studying for some stupid ass test in grade 10 is more important than her studying how to be a not terrible mom in these areas.
[1:29:53] That's very fair. I don't think she kind of trusted psychology as a science. She was more of the biology and like,
[1:30:00] You know. It's not a matter of psychology. Nobody's saying that she's got to trust psychology. Well, there's not one, hang on, there's not one parenting expert out there on the world who says that the healthiest thing for you to do as a parent is scream until your face is red if your children get a B.
[1:30:14] That's true.
[1:30:15] That's just shitty parenting. That's out of control shitty parenting.
[1:30:19] Right. I agree.
[1:30:21] Okay. All right.
[1:30:22] So, all that being said, so, so, the, the argument for the one-time use of psilocybin for me was after this shitty upbringing after this intense anxiety and depression i had for not fulfilling this grand destiny that um you know out of control mother had inspired in me i was kind of stuck i was depressed you know not motivated not moving just kind of sitting around in place right and i did some reading and i found that like uh these like Like diagnosed depression and anxiety disorder actually forms this myelin sheath between your processing center and your amygdala. So it's a spontaneous fear generation that sort of paralyzes your body. And it's this neural connection that's very rapid. So it almost overrides the consciousness inside your own head to say, don't even worry about that. Don't think about it. Don't do anything. Just stay still.
[1:31:27] Right?
[1:31:27] And there's a couple of ways out of this. One of them is sort of a meta-thinking, and they've done some studies on this where cognitive behavioral therapy works. And you actually sit there and you think, does this sort of thinking lead to what I want in my future? And for a lot of people, that will actually delete this myelin sheath and reorganize the neurons such that you can now think in a plethora of different ways.
[1:31:52] Yoga is another one. They do something called mindfulness, where they sit there and they literally visualize these negative thoughts, put them in a bubble, and send them off into the universe. And that does the same thing. You'll see this myelin sheath break down. So the argument for psilocybin is that it actually has some plasticity effects with the brain where neural connections that you don't ordinarily have are activated right so instead of going to this root cause straight from the amygdala down to the fear down sorry straight from the processing center down to the amygdala now your brain is sitting there and it's thinking like weird stuff. It's just kind of jarring. For me, it was like a horrible trip. It was like experiencing hell. It was just horrible visions of like maggots coming out of my face, demonic runes, like shirts jumping, turning into murderers and jumping out at me, you know, and it was awful. And it lasted for hours and hours and hours. And then when I finally came out of it, I was like completely drained of all of my adrenaline. And I just, it just kind of gave me a new perspective on life. It was like, you know, as like book do you do? I didn't get a perfect score, but like that's compared to like the hell I was just experiencing, that's nothing. And from there, it's like, yeah, since then, it's been a lot easier to cope with anxiety and depression and things like that because it's just seems so pitiful and meaningless compared to like the suffering that you can physically experience.
[1:33:21] So i i thought it was useful in that regard
[1:33:23] I think that's very interesting very helpful now did you and a couple of questions did your therapist talk about the verbal abuse that you suffered from your mother i.
[1:33:35] Had a couple different ones and yeah it was it was broached
[1:33:39] Okay and was it like that's really bad parenting and and that's abusive and you should talk to her about that yeah but it's like sorry the therapist said that?
[1:33:51] Yes. Yeah, they encourage you to...
[1:33:52] Okay, and did you talk to your mother about the torrents of screaming when you were a kid?
[1:33:59] I'm sure we've discussed it, but it...
[1:34:01] Nah, you'd remember. No, no, don't rubber bones me, bro. You'd remember.
[1:34:08] It's sort of not worth broaching the subject with her. She's set in her ways and has been probably since she was... No, it's not for her.
[1:34:14] It's not for her. I mean, it's not for her. It's not to change her. It's just to be honest.
[1:34:20] Yeah. I mean, she just denies things. She's just like, no, that didn't, I didn't do that.
[1:34:25] Oh, so now she gaslights you.
[1:34:28] Or she generally doesn't remember. I can't, I can't know her mind.
[1:34:32] No, no, no, no. Come on. That's, I don't remember is a co. All right. Unless she's had some sort of brain injury. And are you married?
[1:34:41] No, no, I'm not.
[1:34:42] Right. Do you know why?
[1:34:45] We had this discussion a couple of days ago, actually.
[1:34:49] Okay, so what do you remember?
[1:34:52] Bipolared mom, bipolar girlfriend, modeling my father's dating behavior.
[1:34:57] Right. So, the silo bison, is that what it's called?
[1:35:01] Yeah, I'd say so.
[1:35:03] Okay. It didn't give you any moral insights.
[1:35:06] It did. It did.
[1:35:08] No, it didn't. No, it didn't. Because a moral insight is I've been treated in an abusive manner. I need to confront the abuser. I need to work for apologies, restitution. and if I can't get any of those things, I don't have to stay in an abusive relationship. I mean, what's your relationship like with your mom now?
[1:35:24] It's pretty good. We chat like once a week.
[1:35:27] It's pretty good. So she verbally abused you as a child, drove you through an excess of verbal abuse, you know, to some degree, I would argue, into this depression and anxiety, kind of crippled you and moved forward and set you up for a whole lifetime so far of pretty bad relationships. And she won't even admit any fault and she gaslights you. But your relationship is good? Are you kidding me?
[1:35:51] I mean, you only get one mom, right? It's like, I still love her.
[1:35:55] Don't give me a fucking fortune cookie, bro. Come on. Don't give me all of this crap. Come on. Come on. I mean, listen, if you have a kid, right? You have a kid. What's your favorite boy's name?
[1:36:09] John.
[1:36:10] John. Okay. It's a solid Anglo-Saxon name. Okay. So you're married. You got a little kid, John. He's like, I don't know, four years old, three years old. and you and your wife go out for dinner and you hire a babysitter. She seems nice. And you come back and John is shaking and trembling and he's peed himself because, the babysitter has been screaming at him because he dropped a cup of milk, right? Right. What do you feel?
[1:36:39] I would be livid.
[1:36:41] I'd be angry, right? Mm-hmm. What would you say to the babysitter?
[1:36:45] Oh, she'd be fired on the spot.
[1:36:47] Right what would you say i mean i don't you have to give me the speech but you'd be pretty critical and like how dare you and all of that right right right so why is john your imaginary son worthy of your outrage protection but you're not well because.
[1:37:05] I'm a man and i just i've dealt with everything i've handled it you know as a child like i wouldn't want someone to have to do what I've done with my own mind but I have managed to do it and it's you make the best of what you got. And is it worth like fighting your one and only mother? Not fighting, just not lying.
[1:37:29] Yeah. Oh, you're going to give me, she did the best you could with the knowledge she had. Okay. So if that's the standard, if that's a good standard to say, well, you did the best you could with the knowledge you had, that's a good standard. That's her standard, right? Then why on earth would she be yelling at you for not getting perfect on your tests? Hey man, you're just, you're doing the best you could but the knowledge you had at the time.
[1:37:48] That's very true but i can i can think that i'm more emotionally evolved than my own mother i am the next generation
[1:37:57] Not if you're lying to her how's that emotionally involved.
[1:37:59] I mean sometimes a white lies spare feelings for people that you know can't change it it's like you know if you have an ugly mug i'm not going to tell you it over and over again no
[1:38:10] No you're born with an ugly mug an ugly mug is not a man such a sophist An ugly mug is not the same as voluntarily choosing to scream at children.
[1:38:20] Right. I mean, she wasn't screaming at me for the SAT score. She thought I did quite well. It was just the expectation had been set for so many years.
[1:38:28] I'm not even talking to you, bro. All I'm doing is talking to your mom. This is just your mom. She's just in here fighting and defending and gaslighting. I'm not even talking to you. I'd like to talk to you. You seem like a cool guy to talk to, but I'm not even talking to you.
[1:38:41] This is all just excuses and justifications pouring out of your mom. Fair.
[1:38:45] Enough I do get defensive over my parents I do love them I know they were flawed
[1:38:50] Okay Well I guess you can continue to love them But it's going to keep quality women from your life Alright Johnny Johnny What's on your mind? Don't forget to unmute, Going once, going twice. Are we done? Yes, sir, go ahead.
[1:39:10] No, this is great. Thank you for sharing. My pleasure. I can relate to the last guy a little bit. I did confront my mother, though, and it was one of those things where she had a cry and said, I did the best with what I had, and it was like a moment.
[1:39:32] What did she do that you didn't appreciate or didn't like?
[1:39:38] She was one of those, I guess you could say, aggressive, emotional, very verbally more abusive, I'd say.
[1:39:52] Did she call you names?
[1:39:56] It was more like stupid, I think was the main word. she liked to use you know don't be stupid you know like it's
[1:40:05] All strange to me of course because she's half your genetics iq is largely genetic so calling you stupid is just an insult to herself it's just very strange to me yeah anyway go on.
[1:40:14] I think also too it's uh you know you think about the the lineage of like how they were handled you know that's why i give my mother a pass almost for like you know nobody's perfect right we're all striving but the the thing is it's like what did i learn from her looking at my grandparents and knowing and asking those questions about that when
[1:40:40] Has she apologized without making excuse because sounds like she's making excuses.
[1:40:43] Yeah she'll never but that's the funny thing she'll never apologize like legit like i've talked to my godmother who's more motherly to me as far as like you know who i can call on the phone and who's been there for me in those tough times and whatnot,
[1:40:57] Like, she's... And are you, sorry to interrupt, I just want to make sure I get to the core of it. Are you married?
[1:41:05] No.
[1:41:06] And how old are you?
[1:41:08] 43.
[1:41:10] Have you ever been married?
[1:41:11] No.
[1:41:12] Why do you think that is? Oh, you have three kids, but you've never been married.
[1:41:17] With the same, yeah. We still, you know, share a home together.
[1:41:23] Oh, so you're together with the mother of your children. children, you're just not formally married.
[1:41:28] Yeah.
[1:41:29] Wait, there was a long pause there. I'm not sure what that meant.
[1:41:34] We came together for a family and we're honoring that together. That's important. I'd say the dynamics we raised a lot different and that makes things difficult at times as far as standards go and how we both The way we see the way things should be with the kids and everything else, I think that's just...
[1:42:01] But you're striving to raise your children differently than how you were raised, to some degree, is that right?
[1:42:07] Yeah, my kids have gotten awards at school for being student of the, you know, great kid of the month and all that other stuff. Like, they're good, they're great kids.
[1:42:14] That's fantastic. Well, congratulations. I'm obviously thrilled that you're breaking the chain here. So, how can I help you philosophically?
[1:42:21] Well, I just thought it was interesting. I just wanted to give perspective. Um, because again, I think there's a generation and what happens is I never liked a victim card, right? Someone has to break it. Like we can all say we were victims at one point in time, but what good is that to us? You know, like if it is, it doesn't empower us to know that we, it's not our fault. I think that's, that's a great, great argument. I like that a lot. Cause I, I have that my own problem is a self-love I would call it instead of, you know, uh,
[1:42:54] But you were a victim as a child, right?
[1:42:58] But again, what do you say victim? I didn't have it nearly as bad as something.
[1:43:02] No, no, no. But you were. I didn't say, look, everyone is like, well, there's one person on the planet who had the very worst childhood known to man. I'm not that person. And it's like, so? You know, that's like saying, well, I'm not going to go to the doctor because there's always someone sicker than me. And it's like, what does that matter? I mean, you didn't have that comparison as a kid. You suffered as a kid if your mother was negative or your father was negative. And you suffered as a kid. And taking this view from orbit, like, ah, but throughout the span of human history, it's like, but that's not how you experience things as a child. As a child, you did not choose the family you were born into. And if you were mistreated, you couldn't leave and you were a victim.
[1:43:46] Okay.
[1:43:47] I mean, if I'm wrong, maybe I've misunderstood something about sort of the nature of life. and I'm happy to be schooled on this, but it is certainly the case that you didn't choose. It certainly is the case that you can't fight back and it certainly is the case you can't leave.
[1:44:00] Well, and I'll tell you this, same as with everyone else. I think all humans are imperfect. I don't think anyone's perfect. And if, you know,
[1:44:10] If we say- But that's not the standard. Come on. The standard is not perfection. That's like saying, well, one guy is dying of cancer and one guy stubbed his toe and you say, well, nobody's perfectly healthy. It's like, but you still have standards. You still have degrees, right?
[1:44:26] Correct.
[1:44:28] I mean, if you ding your car or you completely total it by it rolls off a cliff down into the Grand Canyon, you say, well, no car is perfectly without dings. It's like, yeah, but one of them has a little ding and the other one is in a little box. That's a crumpled nest, right?
[1:44:41] I always thought, you know, it was a good line that I appreciated.
[1:44:47] Your job as a parent is to not screw your kids up as much as your parents screwed you up.
[1:44:55] That was the way that someone put it I heard along the way where it was like, you know what, I kind of like that because you're not going to be perfect parent. We all have our moments or whatever, right? It's not mindful and knowing that they are innocent and they need to be treated like these precious, wonderful flowers that are growing and very delicate. But at the same time, I don't believe also we need to put these bubbles around them to make them. One of the things I had trouble with was the idea of the Easter bunny. Because what is it doing? It's teaching that it's okay to lie right to your kid's face. So I was like, you know what? When they get older, they're just going to see like, oh, it's okay to lie to your kids. And I'm like, that's so deceitful. right? So do I want them to say, oh, it's okay. I mean, I, they've deceived me for years. Why should I, like, do you understand that part where it's like, I, I constantly battle them.
[1:46:03] Yeah. You, you can tell them, look, here's, here's a great story. You know, I mean, I taught, taught them to do tell your kids about Santa Claus. Sure. It's a great story. Yeah. It's a great story. And the Easter Bunny, the Tooth Fairy, they're great stories. Nothing wrong with great stories. I mean, we don't watch Ratatouille thinking that there's rats that can cook, right? So, yeah, it's a great story. But, yeah, you don't teach it as if it's true because it's not. And that's just lying to them.
[1:46:26] Yeah. See, that's the parents who go all out and make it. It's more for them. They're entertaining themselves at the expense of the child when it comes down to it. If you really want to go philosophy on that one, you know, it's like we got to play the role of...
[1:46:40] Well, it's also a superiority thing. Like they kind of, they trust, look how much they trust me and I can do this and I can do that. It's a little bit of a power trip and all that. Okay. Well, I appreciate that. Is there anything else that we could chat about tonight?
[1:46:51] No, I really enjoy this and I'm grateful. Thank you. Great hope.
[1:46:56] Thank you. I appreciate that. And thank you, of course, so much for what you're doing for the world. There's really nothing better that we can do than peaceful parenting and peacefulparenting.com. The book is free. You've got a whole AI there that you can ask questions of multi-language. There's a Spanish version of Peaceful Parenting as well. I hope that you will check it out. There's a long version. There's a short version if you're in a big hurry or you haven't have enough psilobiasin to get your focus up. So this Sunday, 11 a.m., I'm going to do a show. It's for donors only. So you can get that, of course, at freedomain.locals.com or subscribes.com slash freedomain. Really appreciate that. And have yourself a wonderful evening. Thank you everyone so much for calling in tonight. An absolute joy and pleasure to have these conversations with you. Lots of love, my friends. Take care. I'm going to give it a couple of seconds to close off. And if I don't see you Sunday, I will probably do a spaces Monday morning and then definitely Wednesday night. We'll have a live stream like this. And thanks again so much, everyone. FreeDomain.com slash donate to help out the show. Thank you.
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